chase has in school suspension

[puzzled]

Tomorrow is a first for me and for Chase...he has ISS. None of my kids has ever had to do this....but then again Chase has introduced me to many firsts, both good and bad...

I have been concerned about this being the last step before an Out of school suspension, and have been quite stressed about it all week. My husband of course, is saying.."Well his grades are good, and I am glad he is standing up for himself...so don't worry!" I cannot get through dh head that times are different in these days from when we were kids...a schoolyard scuffle no longer just results in just a trip to the principals office or a detention, it may well mean suspension, or expulsion, and that WILL affect his grades! Also, Chase needs to learn better ways to deal with peers, not aggression.

Anyhow, I had a call into the principal to find out just what ISS entails and to address my fears of OSS in Chase's future. He called me this afternoon and explained the ISS rules, and when I told him of my concerns, told me that the only way that Chase would get suspended, was if he blatantly went after another child with malice and no provocation. So, since Chase generally only defends himself, we should be OK. But I am not going to fill him on on this fact.....I want him to be afraid to be kicked out of school, and to think twice before he fights.

[misty]

Of course you will worry....its what moms DO! It was good you talked to the principal & had at least some of your worries eased.



You know, I work as a lunchroom monitor. Every day the kids have a few minutes of silence at the beginning & again at the end of lunch. If a child talks, stands up, dances around, etc during these minutes, we have to give him or her a lunch detention (they serve it the next day).

I've been watching the SAME kids get called day after day after day. I started watching these kids during lunch & I BET most of them are ADHD or something similar. I can tell that they just CANT sit still, CANT keep themselves from moving or talking for any extended period.

I hear the teachers on lunchroom duty talking & they view these kids as simply behavior problems. They consider them "Bad". I mentioned to one teacher that I can tell some of these kids have attention difficulties & don't they have IEP's in place & the teacher basically blew it off. Ok, sure a few of the ones that get in trouble DO simply have an attitude problem but what about the ones that have more serious problems? How is giving them lunch detentions day after day after day helping? It HAS to make them feel terrible about themselves, plus I bet it makes their peers reject them even more than they normally would.

It just burns me up! Not only that, but the kids at this school RARELY get recess.

[lisacap]

Puzzeled,
What does an ISS entail, and I am curious to know, is the other child with whom he was defending himself from also in ISS...this furiates me to no end, when Christian was younger and got in trouble in school, that was always my first question, what happened, who started it and are they both in for the same punishment. When I got an answer of , well Christian hit the boy, I always said, so you are telling me that he just walked up to this child and hit him for no reason...I don't think so, I would then talk to Christian and find out what happened, and most of the time he lashed out because of what some one said or did to him, but because at his young age he was already labeled a problem, no one ever believed him...I don't know what Chase did to have been given an ISS, but if he was defending himself, and the other child isn't in trouble, you need to question Chase at what really happened. I have found over the years that Christian doesn't lie when caught..he may take a few try's but always ends up telling the truth and if Chase is saying he was defending himself, he probalbly was....

[puzzled]

I am finding out that I am extremely lucky as far as school officials go by reading a lot of your and others' experiences on the other boards...

ISS is where the kids that are in trouble for the last week and a half or so have to go into a classroom with a substitute teacher that is hired to supervise them. They spend the day in the classroom , working on the assignments that their teachers have provided for them. In Chase's case, he has 3 tests tomorrow, 1 in Spelling, 1 in Soc. Studies, and 1 in Science. I am not sure if he will have work in Reading and Math or not, but most likely. The principal says that there are 4 boys in this session, Chase, Seth (the boy he fought with) and 2 first graders who also have fought on the playground. They go to lunch in the lunchroom as usual, and get a private recess at some point in the PM if they have behaved in the AM. Which should be interesting because Seth and Chase do NOT mix!!! I told him to play far away from him at recess. The boy is a troublemaker whose parents will not admit it, always blaming every one else for his problems. In fact, his mother has already called the principal to tell him that Seth will not be in the ISS, so I may not have to worry about it at all. I suspect that she will just keep him home to try to avoid the punishment, but the principal says he will just serve it the next week and have more added on if that happens.

The principal has told me in the past that he knows Chase does not lie, and like your ds, he will honestly tell on himself, this time no one saw the fight, but Chase went to the playground aide and told her that Seth had pushed him twice after Chase called him on breaking the "tag" rules and then Chase kneed him on the stomach, and seth punched him in his stomach, knocking the breath out of him. Seth of course did not admit to the initial pushing. Chase could just have easily just told that Seth punched him, and denied anything Seth said he had done, but he owned up to his misdeeds.

The principal is very understanding of Chase and his issues and we have had many talks about how much Chase takes before he blows...I often tell him what has gone on on occasions when Chase is NOT in trouble, he is aware that Chase tries to not fight....

Chase also said that on the day of the fight, each of them lost a recess as punishment. On the recess that Chase lost, seth went out and vice versa. Apparently seth got into ANOTHER fight and got into more trouble.....who do you think is the problem here......?

chase said that when seth approached his usual tag group and asked to join, he KNEW that it was a bad idea but the others agreed, so he went along with it. The next day or so, seth again approached the group and the others all said, "No, the last time we let you, you hit Chase!" That made me feel good and I am sure Chase did as well.

[charliegirl]

It really bothers me to see the one who initiated things getting the same punishment as the one who defended himself. Maybe violence isn't the answer but when a kid has used up every other method, what is left?

Why, when the teachers know they are oil and water, don't they watch the kids more closely, especially when they are playing with or near each other. A child shouldn't have to resort to fighting off a bully in school. He should be protected.

Misty, why do they have a few minutes of silence before and after lunch? What is their reasoning? It sounds like a system set up just to entrap kids who can't sit still or quietly. I'd be bored out of my mind. Why don't they just open the doors and shove them out to recess?

Oh Puzzled, I feel for your son. I'm proud of him that he tries to not fight back at first. What happens when he goes to the teacher and tells her that he is being tormented? Will she intervene then?

[puzzled]

Well most of Chases problems with these kids occur where there are no teachers around...these little boogers are not dumb, they pick the perfect times....on the playground or the bus....on the playground there are 2 aides but in my experience (I have witnessed this myself) they are standing off to one side chitchatting with one another, and cannot see the whole area clearly. Fortunately, one of the aides also subbed in Chase's preschool class years ago, and has a huge soft spot for him. If she is one of the ones on duty, she will intervene, usually w/o him having to tell, I think she looks out for him, but the others are clueless, and you know little boys, they don't want to be tattletales (girls do not have as much issue with tattling in my experience). In the bus situation, the driver has really tried hard to tell Chase that if he tells her of taunting, teasing, bullying, she will punish it, but he is so used to the other driver that retired last year doing nothing for years, that it is difficult for him to trust that she is on his side. She also likes Chase and said that next year when he moves to the middle school/high school route, he can sit with Jake and his buddies, who will stick up for him, Jake has some good friends that are well raised boys, polite and kind.

Chase does use words first, but he is less and less tolerant of the brats, and is tending to hit sooner than he used to in the past. I think that the med (guanfacine) is helping him to cope a little better, and I know that at home he is calmer and is sleeping better, so that is a plus. Or maybe it is the Ritalin LA/guanfacine combo, but whatever it is, as long as the focus and is there (waiting for the report tomorrow from teachers) I definitely like it better and so does he.

I am awaiting info from the site that lillian posted earlier, and I intend to prepare to get accommodations for him in behavior/social if possible. Jon says he thinks I am nuts and he will not get in enough trouble to get kicked out of school, that the school will want to keep him due to his exceptional grades, but I say it never hurts to be prepared and have things in place to protect his schooling.

[misty]

I agree that it never hurts to be prepared. I also hope they are watching Seth carefully. How much can Chase possibly take before he does start to get aggressive? People can only be pushed so far & its awful that Chase has to keep taking it & taking it. Seth is a bully & needs to be stopped from picking on other kids.

Charlie Girl, They say theres not enough room on the playground for more than one class at a time. They do rotate classes to go out when the weather is nice, but even then the kids are only out for about 10 minutes, tops.
The silent minutes in the beginning of lunch are supposed to be so the kids are listening to the announcements. After lunch, my guess is its just to shut them up & yes, possibly a trap for the "problem kids".
I've noticed the the kids the teachers like never get caught or called for lunch detention, even if they are talking & acting up.

[puzzled]

Misty, I have a story about 'quiet time' at lunch....years ago, when Chelsea was in 1st grade or so...I was working at the "secret santa" tables at the holidays, and they were set up at one end of the cafeteria. I would hear the lunchroom aides having 'quiet contests" with the various tables to see who got released first for recess. I thought it was cruel...the children were not out of hand, they were not even being allowed normal conversation the entire time! My feeling is that lunch is just as much social interaction as time to eat! The kids are not allowed to talk during class socially, and recess is for running and playing, so why not let them converse at lunch while they are eating? Anyhow my friend and I who were both officers in the PTO at the time, ate lunch with our girls at the lunch tables. When the lunchroom aides started in with the "quiet time" game, my friend said, "that's all right, we don't want to win this game do we?" I was shocked but went along and we kept on having our normal conversations with each other and "lost" the competition, but had an enjoyable lunch! The aides glared at us the entire time, but oh well....I am ornery ;D

[charliegirl]

Misty, thats sad. There isn't room on the playground for all the kids to get to go work off all that energy so they have to site quietly.

I understand they can't have pandemonium and chaos in the lunch room but kids should be allowed to talk. Thats one advantage the smaller schools have. We have playgrounds and all the kids get to use them.

[misty]

Yes, my daughters school is much smaller & all the kids go out every day, even when its cold!


Today at the school I'm in, the 6th grade was forced to have a silent lunch. NO ONE was allowed to talk, whisper, laugh, etc for the full lunch period. All because yesterday they weren't quiet during their silent minutes.